VN commodore trigger wheel

[antus]

I was at the wreckers today and came across a VN balancer on the ground. I got some pics, so if considering using VN/VP commodore coil packs you can get an idea of what your going to need to do.

Obviously this one was a bit bent and knocked around when it was removed.

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[charlay86]

I drew this from the manual.
Shouldn't be too hard to make make two flat trigger wheels like this:

crank trigger.pdf

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mount them with some form of spacer between them and then use the V6 crank angle sensor on it's side.

[antus]

[blue monaro]

Hi Guys,

i'm looking at doing the delco conversion on a Holden 3.3l black motor. i understand the delco can run it by modifying the standard dizzy, but has anyone tryed the conversion using the DFI ignition? I like the idea of the waste spark system.


I've been looking at making a flat version of the interupter rings shown above and bolting them to the front of the harmonic balancer. I may be able to mount the hall effect switch between the harmonic balancer and altenator. This will keep it away from the drive belt.

Does anyone have any experiance doing this? Can anyone see any potential issues with this?

Thanks

[festy]

If you use a D1928a DFI module in place of the commodore one, the trigger wheel is much simpler.

[DieselBob]

GM 60° V6 DIS ignition system.

The DIS ignition system has multiple operating modes. These are firstly the initial starting,
then engine running under approx. 400 RPM, and finally over 400 in EST/Bypass mode.

First the initial ignition mode is used while the stater motor is cranking the engine,
the DIS module controls all spark with pre-set circuits. Once the engine fires and
starts to increase RPM the DIS module switches to base spark mode this again is controlled
by the DIS circuits giving a linear calculated advance angle, this continues up to 400 RPM.
After 400 RPM the ECM begins to control the spark angle either with a signal to the DIS
module to use its inbuilt timing circuit or to use a calculated control signal from the ECM to
drive the timing circuits.

The system uses a trigger wheel, a double Hall Effect pick up, the DIS and the ECM. The trigger
wheel has 2 interrupter rings, 1 with 3 interrupts the other with 18, the 18 interrupt is a high
resolution RPM signal generator used by both the DIS and the ECM to adjust timing angle.
The signal is conditioned by a divide by 6 circuit and then output to the ECM. The 3 interrupt is
the timing control signal used only by the DIS, all 3 interrupts are of varying length to allow the
system to accurately fire the engine, and the official blurb is the correct plug will fire within
60° of rotation.

DIS Pinouts.
A. EST Signal In
B. Bypass Signal In
C. 18x Signal Out
D. DIS Module ref High
E. Tacho Output Dash Out
F. Cam Signal Out
G. 18x Signal In
H. 3x Signal In
J. Cam Signal In
K.
L. DIS Module ref Low (Earth)
M. Hall Pickup Grounds (Crank, Cam)
N. Hall Pickup Power Supply Out
P. Ignition Switched Power Supply In

I’ve only used this on the 808 so I’m not sure about the 18x output on the later models,
I’ve read that the ECM has control of the timing circuit after the initial crank sequence
with a high resolution input to the ECM.

Hope this helps..

[festy]

Thanks, DieselBob - very interesting...
I wonder if it would be possible to ditch the 18x ring, and have a little mcu faking that signal by driving a pwm signal of 1/6 the period between the 3x rising(?) edges - i.e. the time between the end of each 3x gap, as they end 120 deg apart? It would only be 1/3rd crank revolution behind during rpm changes.
You wouldn't get the correct cylinder firing in the first 60 deg, but neither do the 7x DIS modules...

[DieselBob]

I've gotten busy over the last couple of months.
Was in the process of trying to running a ignition module on the bench.
Haven't been able to get the time as yet.
Simulating the 18x signal would be easy, the 3x would take a bit more with out using logic.
Sycning the pulses shouldn't be that hard..
Making the trigger wheel after looking at the pic from charlie86 seems straight forward
give the drawing to a lazer cutter just need enough room for the pickups - prox's would be better
the DIS has a signal cleaner on the inputs to filter noise....
I'm off work for 2 weeks might get a chance to run one..

Edit
If your going to run the Ignition base without coil packs I'd suggest loading the circuit with
100w halogens to stop a burn out.