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On a non Delco related subject wanted to share a warning with you all regarding consumer rights in Oz. A shiny new fishfinder appeared under my Xmas tree and have been very keen to get a line wet to hopefully catch some fish, however the excitement of the install wore off very quickly and was soon replaced with much disappointment.

Having confirmed with the sales staff at All Boats and Business in Wangara 3 times that the unit included maps before purchasing, I was surprised to find out it did not. Will spare the details but after much arguing when the sales person’s story changed once the manager was involved, matters were taken further.

Now the amazing part of this is the lack of rights we get as a consumer. Contrary to what is written in consumer law, when a sales person says that a product does something and it does not don’t expect a refund! When you have a verbal conversation with a sales person your right to a refund pretty much vanishes, all the sales person has to do is deny ever saying something. They can verbally tell you anything to get the sale.

So ultimately this was the issue as there was no hard evidence for consumer protection to act on due to only phone and in store conversations, a magistrate is then required to reach a decision based on each parties description of the events. Having never been through anything like this before I was unaware of how it worked, even the consumer protection website is not clear that they are unable to act on this situation...
https://www.commerce.wa.gov.au/consumer ... -under-acl

Under fit for purpose it states if a product is described incorrectly in person or over the phone you are entitled to a remedy (which is to make good of the original claims or offer a refund). All well and good until you actually try, but I can also see it from the other side of the coin if retailers were continually forced to give refunds to lying consumers.

At the end of the day it was not worth the cost to pursue things any further and have had to chalk it up as life experience and a lesson learnt, if it was an item of higher value it would be still on going.

So be warned when buying new toys, do your research and do not rely on the salesperson knowing the products or assume they are doing the right thing. I do know there is one shop I will never be returning to, but that is another story!

well that's doesn't surprise me at all because sales people are more often than not dodgy as and only there to get you to buy stuff.

it is fun when I go IT shopping and play dumb, then catch them out with bullshit that I have previously researched etc to know the truth he he

its also amazing how many sales people have "just bought the exact model your looking at" lol!

Yes, it is sad indeed. Generally speaking sales staff are only interested in getting their commission. They will try and sell the item/brand that gets them the best commission rather then what suits you best.

It is fun playing dumb and seeing what shit they spout to try and sell you something.

In many ways the law is an ass, isn't it a shame that the courts would side with the retailer and not the consumer when the law it there to protect the latter. The retailer only cares about their sales and profits.

Well, that sucks. I hope the maps arn't too expensive and can be found at some other shop.

When your on the phone you can note down the date/time, the name of who you spoke too and notes of what they told you. Then if it comes to court you can produce your notes and say "at this day/time, salesman X advised me over the phone in no uncertain terms that maps were included, and I recorded it here" and use that as evidence. Im sure it does not mean an instant win when they are disagreeing, but it has some strength as it can be verified that staff member was on that day, you can produce phone records to show the call to the shop happened at the time stated. Fortunately i've never had to try and use it, but I do take notes like that when I expect something to go wrong or this type of situation to occur. It also makes the sales person a bit less likely to talk less crap when you specifically ask their name and say something which lets them know you're writing down what they say. Suddenly you do have something physical.

i have a recording app on my mobile, when this stuff happens personally or at work it usually clears stuff up quick smart. I hate it though when it catch's people out and the company/sales people get away with it.

The1 wrote:i have a recording app on my mobile, when this stuff happens personally or at work it usually clears stuff up quick smart. I hate it though when it catch's people out and the company/sales people get away with it.

I remember some of my old phones having the ability to record calls.. although seems this feature was quickly removed for whatever reason? (recording without permission?!).

Im sure there would be an android or iphone app available to do this anyway.

Sorry to here you got stung by a useless salesmen VL! Hopefully the maps are a *one-off* payment as many gps systems are to get different international maps.

antus wrote:Well, that sucks. I hope the maps arn't too expensive and can be found at some other shop.

They are pretty much the same cost as the sounder They are encrypted against the SD cards serial number, which sucks as the card is also used to store trails and sounder recordings. So you cant chuck in a bigger card for more storage. AFAIK updates also cost but are cheaper than the initial purchase. Its the Navionics Gold maps.

antus wrote:When your on the phone you can note down the date/time, the name of who you spoke too and notes of what they told you. Then if it comes to court you can produce your notes and say "at this day/time, salesman X advised me over the phone in no uncertain terms that maps were included, and I recorded it here" and use that as evidence. Im sure it does not mean an instant win when they are disagreeing, but it has some strength as it can be verified that staff member was on that day, you can produce phone records to show the call to the shop happened at the time stated. Fortunately i've never had to try and use it, but I do take notes like that when I expect something to go wrong or this type of situation to occur. It also makes the sales person a bit less likely to talk less crap when you specifically ask their name and say something which lets them know you're writing down what they say. Suddenly you do have something physical.

Yeah had all this, but consumer protection still dont know the content of the call or in store conversation so only a magistrate can decide an outcome based on each parties story. The consumer laws are only really of use if its a high value item. While you supposedly have rights the only way to exercise them easily is to have written evidence (which really works in the favour of online sales with an advertisement), if you dont have any written evidence then it starts costing you to contest it. With days off work and court fees it starts to quickly eat in to any refund you may or may not get.

The1 wrote:i have a recording app on my mobile, when this stuff happens personally or at work it usually clears stuff up quick smart. I hate it though when it catch's people out and the company/sales people get away with it.

This is what was needed! I think you have to disclose that the call is recorded, but even that is enough to stop any bullshit. The salesperson admitted in store after I went back to query why the maps didnt work he knew nothing about the product and would have to get someone else who knows more. Didnt stop them making the original sale