265 Hemi to efi

[heff0018]

Oh, the original setting was 60 degrees but I changed it to 10 degrees. Not correct? I must be misinterpreting things

[Jayme]

no you have the right idea... 10 degrees is right for any car using a camira setup.... im concerned about the no spark thing... it should still spark with ecu disconnected. the camira module only requires trigger, power and earth and it will spark the coil as per a normal ignition with no connection to the ECU. go over your wiring and make sure you have power to the ignition module with the ecu disconnected. also as said previously it doesnt run right if the sensor wires are wrong way around... it actually alters the amount of advance and doesnt provide a very trigger for the spark.

I th9ink you should work on getting spark with the camira module on its own for now. and if its not the same advance as when you run the MSD, then swap polarity on the sensor and see if it matches.

can you post up the bin you are currently running so we can check it for you?

[heff0018]

No, just downloaded and opened Holden202's straight six bin file in TunerPro and it shows the spark reference angle at 9.84, so correct.

Stuffed if I know what the problem is. Question, should/can I physically move the dizzy to change the timing when running on the ecu. I had been thinking not as this was the reason I set it at 10 degrees initially and then put the ecu in diagnostic mode to lock the timing. To align the physical timing advance to the ecu's advance. Then the ecu controls the timing of the spark from then on. Any way that's how I had interpreted the setup. Cheers

[heff0018]

no you have the right idea... 10 degrees is right for any car using a camira setup.... im concerned about the no spark thing... it should still spark with ecu disconnected. the camira module only requires trigger, power and earth and it will spark the coil as per a normal ignition with no connection to the ECU. go over your wiring and make sure you have power to the ignition module with the ecu disconnected. also as said previously it doesnt run right if the sensor wires are wrong way around... it actually alters the amount of advance and doesnt provide a very trigger for the spark.

I th9ink you should work on getting spark with the camira module on its own for now. and if its not the same advance as when you run the MSD, then swap polarity on the sensor and see if it matches.

can you post up the bin you are currently running so we can check it for you?

Thanks Jayme, now that does make sense. There was definitely no spark with the ecu disconnected so will check that problem.
So most important to get the Camira module working without CPU. Check advance and if no good I will reverse the polarity and try that.

I don't have bin file on this laptop so will post bin tonight.

[Charlescrown]

So the question I have is why do the VN V6 have a spark reference angle of 70 (or near enough) and 202 is using 10 for an inline 6. I have 2 4 cylinders cars using 12P and have set them both to 10 degrees reference angle. Maybe theirs something I am missing but I understand the spark reference angle is to set the program up to run on a specific numbers of cylinders and the actual ignition timing when in diagnostic mode is set to 10 degrees by adjusting the distributor.

[Charlescrown]

OK after some serious dr google I now know what spark reference angle is all about. YES all engines using an inductive pickup type distributor are set to 10 degrees. Its Hall effect that are different. Check the polarity of the trigger.

[heff0018]

Just realised something. I found this post on 'tune chevy Camaro with 12P' posted by Jayme.

'if you have the ref angle at 10 degrees then thats what you should time the dizzy to with the est wire disconnected'

So you just disconnect the est wire not unplug the actual ECU? ha, ha, I hope that's right. Double doh if correct. Cheers

[Holden202T]

easiest way to do it if you want to leave it all connected is to put the ecu into diagnostic mode, this will lock the timing at 10 degrees then adjust dizzy and your done.

the reason for 10 degrees reference in dizzy setup is because when the computer is not controlling it you need a bit of advance to get the motor to start (think old school dizzy base timing) then once its in EST mode the ecu takes over.

60 degrees reference angle in a V6 is how far away from TDC the sensor is when it fires the coil.

[heff0018]

Thanks Sam, I will give that a shot.

[Charlescrown]

No my knowledge is the spark reference angle is to ensure correct alignment of the rotor and cap and has no direct reference to actual timing. The 10 degrees in diagnostic mode is to ensure your timing maps are correct eg if your map says 30 degrees at a specific point of load and speed it is on the basis of the initial setting in diag mode being 10 degrees. If you set it to say 4 degrees and looked at that same point in the map you would have to take 6 degrees of which means the real timing is actually only 24 degrees.
As I said before a VN has an angle of 70 degrees and my VR V8 is 60 degrees because they are Hall effect. I remember the Mitsubishi distributor installation on both 4 and V6 where the distributor went in was way out of the position of normal thinking and to this day never new why. Boy we learn new things everyday and today I learn't a lot.